Life & Safety with Jimmy Rios
Welcome to Life & Safety with Jimmy Rios! Get ready to dive into a world where safety meets storytelling! Drawing from his rich background as a former firefighter, EMT and safety expert, Jimmy brings you straight into the heart of safety and emergency preparedness. Episodes feature easy-to-understand tips, real-life stories, and interviews with experts, all designed to help you protect yourself, your business, and those you care about.
Whether it's advice on navigating everyday safety challenges or insights into the latest in health and safety trends, let this podcast educate and entertain you. Join Jimmy and level-up your safety knowledge with engaging discussions that could one day save a life.
Life & Safety with Jimmy Rios
The One Where Jimmy Met a Guy with a DNR Tattoo
You’ve probably seen it in movies... someone collapses, a family member screams “They have a DNR!” and suddenly everyone freezes. But what actually happens in real life when a do-not-resuscitate order enters the scene?
In this episode, Jimmy and Megan dig into what a DNR really means, how it's used in emergency situations, and what makes it legally valid (hint: it’s not a tattoo). Jimmy shares a jaw-dropping story about teaching CPR at a ranch where not one, not two, but three generations of workers had DNRs... and were so serious about it, they even removed the battery from their AED.
From red folders taped to the fridge to expired forms stuffed in safes, they break down the biggest misunderstandings around DNRs and medical directives. You’ll learn why having the paperwork on you is crucial, what responders are legally allowed to do, and why even seasoned EMTs have performed 40 minutes of CPR while someone frantically searched for the right document.
It’s a conversation about planning, choice, and what it really means to respect someone’s wishes during a crisis. Whether you’re a responder, a family member, or just someone who wants to understand this stuff better, this episode clears up a lot of confusion, and may just inspire you to have a hard conversation or two.
Life Safety Associates specializes in emergency response training for corporate ERT Teams. We help businesses create competent and confident first responders who are ready to handle unexpected emergencies. For more information you find us @lifesafetyassoc or email@lifesafety.com.
What's happening to their life and safety podcast with your girl, megs, and Jimmy. Today we're gonna be talking about medical directives, specifically do not resuscitate orders or DNR orders. So there's lots of layers to that do not resuscitate or medical directives. We're gonna only really hit on high level of this. Lots of layers to that do not resuscitate or medical directives. We're going to only really hit on high level of this. We're not lawyers obviously.
Jimmy:Obviously, we don't even play one on TV, right? So we're going to be pretty generic about this, and so the question we get a lot in class Liz, I can speak to this and Megan you can speak to this too is we get people asking us what happens if we show up and the patient has a DNR, right? So before we get into that procedure and what we do with that, let's talk about a do not resuscitate order, what it is and kind of what a medical directive is. So a medical directive is a piece of paper, basically, that has the patient's wishes on it and how much and what they want done with them. As far as medical care does, For whatever reason, sometimes people don't want to be intubated or they don't want to be kept alive by a machine, so to speak, and maybe they want to not be a donor for tissues and things like that, or maybe they only want to donate certain organs or tissues or something like that. So that's all in their medical directives.
Megan:My understanding is, a lot of the times, people who have medical director directives we words are typically like either terminal patients or they have some sort of chronic illness sort of thing. That like has them thinking about those, which is not to say that those are the only people do, but more often my experience with it is more often than not people who have chronic things or fatal things will typically have some sort of medical directive or will know vaguely what they want yeah, and, and mine is more well a lot of that obviously, uh, being the response role.
Jimmy:But my other side of that is also what, um, you know, people's kind of forward thinking you know, some planners, things like that. We used to go to a ranch farm and this place was owned by a pharmaceutical company who raised sheeps and rabbits. Oh, they were not injured. They were not injured. They were not injured. They were actually raised very humanely and had just really an amazing facilities for where the animals lived.
Megan:It was really kind of cool, um well, they want to give their drugs the best chance of survival right.
Jimmy:Well, what they used, though, was actually an agent from their blood for testing, so like if you were testing somebody for drugs and they urinated in the cup, the ages, the reagents in those testing strips came from the blood of these animals.
Jimmy:So, once a week maybe a little bit more than like, less than that, like maybe like once a month these animals donated blood, and they lived in this rad ranch farm situation fascinating and the people that worked there took care of them and then, like once, whenever they, whatever that was they would herd them into these rooms that were pretty clinical, pretty scary looking, to be honest with you, and they would um draw blood from them. But there was three generations out there. There was a grandfather, the and the son all lived or worked on this ranch and they lived close by and all three of them had do not resuscitate orders on them and they were so adamant about it they actually took out the battery of their AED that the company put into the company break room area for the people that worked in this facility.
Jimmy:So it was pretty wild, Pretty wild. So I'm out there teaching them CPR and they were like we're never going to do it and I was like, yikes, okay, you have to write that down.
Megan:I mean good for them, I guess.
Jimmy:Yeah.
Megan:If that's what they want and they're confident in it, yay for choice.
Jimmy:Yeah, exactly Exactly. And, um, the grandfather actually had it tattooed on his chest. You know, people always kind of joke about that and that was like, oh, I'm going to tattoo it on my chest, or something like that. There's a statement. He actually did it and showed it to me.
Megan:Oh, I want to talk about that. That was one of the things I want to talk about. Is that a legally binding request?
Jimmy:So you have to, and this is what I told him. I said you have to have it on you. You actually have to have the paper on you. What I understand, you have to have paper on you and it has to be within date. So the DNRs do expire. Um, I don't remember exactly how long they are for, so I don't know. Maybe you can Google that real quick, but you have to have it on you and it has to be within date. Like I said, they do expire and that's what I told the gentleman. And he's like oh okay, I'm like so where is your DNR at?
Megan:The period can range from one to five years, depending on the state there you go. So one to five years depending on the state.
Jimmy:There you go. So one to five years, depending on the state. So I was like, so where's it at? You'd have to prove it to me. And he was like, well, it's at home in my safe. And I said that doesn't do me any good. How do I know that somebody didn't you know.
Jimmy:Lie yeah, poison you and just write that on your chest and he's like, uh, I don't know right, and I don't know if it's expired or not. Maybe you changed your mind and maybe you're, you know, scorned a lover or scorned a partner, decided to write that on you after they poisoned you. I don't know, you know, and he's like, oh good point. So he and their family, because they're so adamant about not having CPR done on them, actually took them and they stuck them in a folder and they put it on the refrigerator of the break room of the place they worked.
Megan:That's what I've heard is a good place for. When I was in EMT school they said hey, if somebody says that they have any DNR, check the fridge, because a lot of times they'll magnet it to the fridge so it's easy to find in an emergency.
Jimmy:Yes, yeah, and you were kind of talking about terminally ill patients and things like that. They usually have like a red folder or envelope or something like that next to their bed with usually something like DNR or medical directive or something like that on their next to their bed, yeah.
Jimmy:You know. So that's on there a lot. So what happens on the street? So we show up, we're at the mall or wherever, and we want to be a good Samaritan and somebody starts yelling at you don't touch that person, Just have a DNR. That's my insert family member, right? What do we do? That's the question I always get. What do we do? So how do you answer that in your class, and then I'll give you my answer.
Megan:I answered that, legally speaking, you're not required to provide care to anybody. If you're feeling unsafe, like if you feel that you're going to be threatened by this person who's telling you not to provide care for their family member and you think your safety is in danger by providing care, then absolutely step back and don't provide care. That being said, if your safety is in danger, you have no way of knowing if this person is lying to you or not.
Jimmy:So if you feel comfortable providing care, I would provide care personally, but that's a personal choice. Yeah, no, that's what I usually tell people. Also, if it, you know, if you decide to help and you're helping the person and maybe the person feels is maybe threatening or something like that and it's not safe or you don't feel safe anymore, then maybe you should back away, you know, and again, they have to prove it. You can't just walk up and say that you know. It's like me saying I don't know, maybe my wife has a really good life insurance and I'm like no, don't save her, you know, something like that.
Jimmy:That's messed up but that's you know, unfortunately there are people who think like that. So If you don't feel comfortable or it's unsafe for you to be there because of the family, then definitely back away. But if you feel you want to continue to help, it's your help, and to piggyback on what you said, it's your choice, right? It depends on you know, seeing safety. Take care of yourself first and read the room. Yeah, read the room. Yeah, yeah.
Megan:Read the room. Yeah, but I guess overarching is unless they provide you the paperwork, then still provide care unless you feel unsafe.
Jimmy:Yes, absolutely, absolutely.
Megan:And that's the same for EMTs and paramedics is we're trained to provide care until we have the paperwork in hand, with the doctor and the lawyer and the patient's signature.
Jimmy:Yeah, or it has to be notarized or something like that. I don't remember exactly how it was, but yeah, yeah, we actually performed CPR on a lady. My engine crew and an ambulance crew and some volunteer firefighters we all took turns doing CPR on a lady while her son ran around the house looking for the mom's DNR. It was rough, it was rough. And I think the third one he found was the one that wasn't expired and I think we did CPR, did CPR no less than 40 minutes. Oh God, yeah, it was rough. It was rough Like the paramedics were like we're not going to push any meds while you look for this, but we're going to continue compressions. So I think about five of us or six of us like switched doing compressions. It was rough, it was rough. And then, you know, when the sun Gave us the do not resist state order and we stopped and then we had to, you know, help him process what just happened.
Jimmy:Yeah, which was super gnarly, I bet, and crunchy, yeah, yeah, and this was something I didn't know about that. You know, we had to call the county, we had to call the coroner to come pick up this poor lady. Yeah, because we didn't take to call the county, we had to call the coroner to come pick up this poor lady yeah.
Jimmy:Because we didn't take her in the ambulance. So you know, she had to be picked up and that was just kind of a very surreal incident, you know. And the question I get a lot after this kind of comes up in our class is why do people have DNRs and you kind of mentioned the terminally ill, you know something like that People with medical issues. You know that's definitely a big deal of it, but at the end of the day it's that person's choice. What do they want done? You know, how do they want to live their life? How do they want to be treated? You know, and there's religious issues there, um, personal issues, there's all kinds of things not for us to judge why or how come. It's for us to either help them or not help them, based on their wishes right at the end of the day.
Jimmy:um so hopefully that helped you and just kind of shine some light on some do not resuscitate order stuff, what if let's say that you know there is a patient who is in need of help.
Megan:They have a family member shouting saying, hey, they have a DNR. You know, don't provide care and you feel unsafe. But you still want to help but you physically don't feel safe providing care. What's the best thing to do in that scenario?
Jimmy:Well, I still think you call 911.
Megan:Exactly, and you providing care.
Jimmy:What's the best thing to do in that scenario? Well, I still think you call 9-1-1, exactly and, um, you know, get professionals out there, you know, and help the best you can, and that's realistically the only thing we can do. Do the best you can and remember, calling 9-1-1 is helping yeah you know, and don't ever be afraid to call 911.
Jimmy:Even if you don't think it's a big deal, it might be a big deal or it might grow into a big deal. Trust your instincts. Yeah, trust your instincts. All right, team, thanks for visiting us and hanging out with us on our Life and Safety podcast, peace.
